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Thoughts and stuff 
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Post Thoughts and stuff
Edit: I got sick of looking at the title.

Salvete omnes et cetera.

I decided to be original and start a journal that I'll probably never update. A journal about bacon.

Bacon isn't too good on it's own - it serves as a seasoning, or a condiment in hamburgers, but that's about it.

Now that that's (doubled words always look wrong; I had had enough of them long ago) out of the the way, I am free to talk about other things. For the past two weeks, I have been keeping house for a family friend who has been in Washington (state, not D.C.). He has a hole behind his toilet through which all manner of spiders find their way through - maybe it's like a pet door, and I am actually killing his little friends. Anyway, "spare the rod, spoil the spider," as they say, and I certainly haven't spared the rod.

I have passed much of that time, during which I had no web connection (the internetty kind, not the spidery kind, of which there was no shortage), by studying Latin and Greek (lingua latina and ἑλληνιστί). Having not looked too deeply into Greek until now, I can say that it makes an interesting contrast to Latin.

Not much more comes to my mind to say right now, so some random trivia: The Latin word devotio, whence comes our word devotion, referred to "an act of loading yourself up with curses and then going on a suicide mission by charging into the enemies in the belief that your curse would befall anybody you touched. This was usually done as a desperate attempt to turn the tides of a battle in a dire situation." (source)

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Wed Jun 01, 2011 5:51 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
*Mumbles about the bacon comment*

I often wish I was more fluent in other languages, with 7-9 years of french, and high school credit for spanish you think I'd learn something, but nope.

What inspired you to learn latin?

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Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:06 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
I was required to take a year of foreign language, and since I learned through correspondence I thought that a non-spoken language would be best. Now, I'm just kind of addicted to it.

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Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:16 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Oh I see, lol. How have you been lately?

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Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:29 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Decent, I am finally back online full-time (well, except when I'm not). I killed a couple of renegade spiders before finally leaving my post, but fortunately my bedroom had been pest-free during the whole stay.

I just heard that an Arkansas middle school included a list of "the five worst people of all time" in its yearbook. Now, no matter who you are, I'm sure that you will agree that this was done in poor taste, and has no place in a government-funded institution:

The worst five people of all time

1. Adolf Hitler
2. Osama bin Laden
3. Charles Manson
4. George Bush
5. d***s Cheney

...

Seriously? I don't care what side of the spectrum you're on - that is just wrong. Besides my obvious objections to demonizing our former president and vice president, Charles Manson, creep though he is, has no place on the list. I'm not even sure about Hitler and bin Laden - if we're measuring evil by body counts, then maybe (though that still leaves me unsure about the terrorist), but it seems to me that the list is modernist and America-centric. And all of that is only considering the top three, I'm ignoring the last two.

Just a few observations, and really the only thing that I can think to write about.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 6:19 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
You sure you're not mixing up Marilyn Manson and Charles Manson. Charles was planning to commit what I believe was a mass suicide. Marilyn is just weird. But, yeah, I agree that it's in bad taste to put former presidential leaders on a list like that.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 7:34 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
schmete wrote:
You sure you're not mixing up Marilyn Manson and Charles Manson. Charles was planning to commit what I believe was a mass suicide. Marilyn is just weird. But, yeah, I agree that it's in bad taste to put former presidential leaders on a list like that.

Nope, I forgot that Marilyn even existed. Thanks for reminding me x_x

I wasn't detracting from the fact that he was and is pure scum, but there are still a lot of people to put above him in the list.

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Thu Jun 02, 2011 8:12 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Okay, so the school claims that the list was "an oversight". Apparently they downloaded the list from a website without actually viewing its contents. I'm willing to believe them, since sometimes people do incredibly stupid things unintentionally. Let's hope that they actually read what they put in the next year's book, though :p

Tomorrow, I am going to monkey around with our new forum theme in an attempt to do away with the white background and to make the text color match the palette.

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Fri Jun 03, 2011 1:15 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
JAOR part two solved.

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Fri Jun 03, 2011 12:24 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
I just saw the top part and skimmed through the rest of the thread. Shouldn't it be Et Alia instead of et cetera? And yes I agree with the bacon part


Sat Jun 04, 2011 1:10 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
By "et cetera" I meant "and all the rest of those niceties". "Et alia" would have worked as well, though.

Now that I'm back on about Latin, a few random comments for all to ignore at will - the consonant V in Latin is pronounced like our W, and in is in fact the same letter as U, having also vowel qualities. So, vita is pronounced "wii-ta", as I observed in the NGP thread, and can be alternately written as uita, as it is spelt in the best Latin dictionary on the market, the OLD.

The lack of distinction between the letters U and V is not limited to Latin. In old English texts you may see a number of interesting conventions with V and U, which vary from font to font. My favorite archaic convention uses V at the beginning of words, or for capital U and V, with all other positions represented by lower case U, like so: vnder = under, loue = love, thunder = thunder, THVNDER = THUNDER. J and I also played some similar roles together, although I can't remember the specifics over my headache - I think, though, that J was only used in the lower case, and only at the end of a word. Add to this, there were two different lower-case S's, and then a rarely used sharp S (like the one in German).

That is my semi-coherent lecture for the night.

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Sat Jun 04, 2011 1:43 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
SirVenom wrote:
By "et cetera" I meant "and all the rest of those niceties". "Et alia" would have worked as well, though.

Now that I'm back on about Latin, a few random comments for all to ignore at will - the consonant V in Latin is pronounced like our W, and in is in fact the same letter as U, having also vowel qualities. So, vita is pronounced "wii-ta", as I observed in the NGP thread, and can be alternately written as uita, as it is spelt in the best Latin dictionary on the market, the OLD.

The lack of distinction between the letters U and V is not limited to Latin. In old English texts you may see a number of interesting conventions with V and U, which vary from font to font. My favorite archaic convention uses V at the beginning of words, or for capital U and V, with all other positions represented by lower case U, like so: vnder = under, loue = love, thunder = thunder, THVNDER = THUNDER. J and I also played some similar roles together, although I can't remember the specifics over my headache - I think, though, that J was only used in the lower case, and only at the end of a word. Add to this, there were two different lower-case S's, and then a rarely used sharp S (like the one in German).

That is my semi-coherent lecture for the night.
Oh okay, and nice lecture. But I thought that there was no J in latin until medieval times? Classical latin had no J's and used I's, and ecclesiastical added in J's.


Sat Jun 04, 2011 12:07 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Ah, I was actually rambling on about English at that part. Yeah, J is medieval - but so is the distinction of V from U. J fell out of use sometime within the past hundred or so years, but somehow V and U both remain in common use. I like the aesthetics of V*, though, so I'd hate to lose it.

*While only V existed in inscriptions, it more closely resembled a U in written Latin.

P.S. - Just so you know, I'm not lecturing you - you probably had enough of that in class. I'm just talking into the air because I like the sound of my voice :p

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Sat Jun 04, 2011 12:34 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
This is a public service announcement: When you are dealing with partitions, if you press "back", never assume that all of your chosen settings will remain. It is very possible that it automatically defaulted from "Specify partitions manually" to "Erase and use the entire disk". If that were to happen, bad things would follow. Even if you were to press "cancel" immediately after you realized what had happened.

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Tue Jun 07, 2011 12:54 am
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Post Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
I like the Latin lectures.

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Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:30 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
schmete wrote:
I like the Latin lectures.

Thank you. Just for that, I'll post another. Well, also to get my mind off of my computer's predicament, for which I am willing to pay an absurd amount of money if only my data can be saved. Of course, gratis-$30 would be nice.

Puts on speech wig

Attachment:
speechwig.jpg


(lotta ramblin in spoiler boxes)

Pars prima
Spoiler: show
I know that at least one member here studies Japanese - hi, Schmete! Those who do are probably familiar with terms like subject-object-verb (SOV) and subject-verb-object (SVO). They refer to the order of a sentence, and by extension describe an entire language.

For example:

John sees Jane.
John is the subject (the "doer" of the action), sees is the verb, and Jane is the object (the one affected by the action).

This is an example of an SVO sentence. Most grammatically correct sentences in English follow this order, so English is an SVO language.

Now:

ジョンはジェーンを見ている。
(jon wa jein o mite iru)

Jon wa is the subject, Jein o is the object, mite iru is the verb.

This is an example of an SOV sentence. This is the typical order for a Japanese sentence, even though the object may precede the subject (which would make the sentence OSV, object-subject-verb). Since this is typical in Japanese, it is classified as an SOV language.

This is all fine and good. Now for the fun stuff.

There are six different possible word-order classifications (SOV, SVO, VOS, VSO, OSV and OVS). So, which one is Latin? Well, it is considered SOV, like Japanese, but in reality it fits under all of the classifications. The word order in Latin is practically free, and, despite what my primer says, all combinations are used frequently.

All of the phrases in the spoiler box mean "Marcus sees Tullia":


Pars secunda
Spoiler: show
Marcus Tulliam videt.
(Marcus Tullia sees - subject-object-verb)

Marcus videt Tulliam.
(Marcus sees Tullia - subject-verb-object)

Tulliam videt Marcus.
(Tullia sees Marcus - object-verb-subject)

Tulliam Marcus videt.
(Tullia Marcus sees - object-subject-verb)

Videt Marcus Tulliam.
(Sees Marcus Tullia - verb-subject-object)

Videt Tulliam Marcus.
(Sees Tullia Marcus - verb-object-subject)


Pars tertia
Spoiler: show
So, how do we know that John sees Jane, and not the other way around? The same way that we know in Japanese - the subject and object are both marked.

Marcus Tulliam amavit - "Marcus loved Tullia"
Marcum Tullia amavit - "Tullia loved Marcus".

Cool, right?

Well, there are some complications that come with a free word order. A student of Latin must learn five* different cases for noun (and adjective and participle, not to mention gerundive) inflection.

Inflection of gladius (the sword):

gladius - nominative case: "the sword" (as the subject, i.e., "the sword fell")
gladii - genitive case: "the sword's, of the sword"
gladio - dative case: "to/for the sword"
gladium - accusative case: "the sword" (as the direct object, i.e., "I drew my sword")
gladio - ablative case: "by means of/with/from the sword"

Those are the five cases. Post a picture of sushi if you actually read this far. But wait, there's more! What if you are talking about more than one sword? Then you need the plural form!

gladii - nominative plural: "the swords" (as the subject)
gladiorum - genitive plural: "the swords', of the swords"
gladiis - dative plural: "to/for the swords"
gladios - accusative plural: "the swords" (as the object)
gladiis - ablative plural: "by means of/with/from the sword"

Now you're all set! Oh, wait, I lied. After you've memorized all of these, there are at least seven more sets of declensions to memorize for words with different endings.

agricola (the farmer)
nominative - agricola
genitive - agricolae &c.

*Technically seven, but the remaining two cases are limited to a relatively small number of words.

Rather than let this sink in, I'll tell you that this is nothing compared to verbs. There are at least seven verbal classes, and four of those have a whopping 209 forms** to learn... APIECE! And yes, most forms are widely used.

** And that's leaving out the two coniugationes periphrasticae, which add quite a few more. However, these don't really need to be learned, per se, since they are formed by analogy and just make sense.

Ehm... yeah, I can't think of anything more to say right now. Cheerio.


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Wed Jun 08, 2011 10:24 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Btw I took me latin final yesterday...I think I did pretty good, I'll find out tommorrow


Thu Jun 09, 2011 6:32 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Well, here's hoping for the best, Superwes!

Νῦν, I will talk about Greek.

Here is the alphabet:
(note - I won't bother describing the vowels. Treat them like Spanish and you won't be terribly far off.)

Spoiler: show
Αα (alpha, A) Ββ (beta, B) Γγ (gamma, G) Δδ (delta, D)
Εε (epsilon, short E) Ζζ (zeta, DZ) Ηη (eta, long E) Θθ (theta, like the T in "tea")
Ιι (iota, I) Κκ (kappa, K) Λλ (lambda, L)
Μμ (mu, M) Νν (nu, N) Ξξ (xi, X) Οο (omicron, short O)
Ππ (pi, like the P in "taper")
Ρρ (rho, similar the spanish trilled R)
Σσς (sigma, S - the last form is for word endings)
Ττ (tau, unaspirated T. I can't think of an American English equivalent, since we have the habit of pronouncing unaspirated T as D.)
Υυ (upsilon... kind of an unholy hybrid of I and U)
Φφ (phi, like the P in "power")
Χχ (chi, like the C in "can't". This is the first letter of "Christ", which is why Christmas is often abbreviated to Xmas)
Ψψ (psi, like the PS in rhapsody)
Ωω (omega, long O)


Here's an interesting bit of trivia - the Latin alphabet used to begin ABCDEFZ (compare to the Greek ΑΒΓΔΕΖ - Greek used to have a symbol resembling an F between E and Z), with the C pronounced like a G. When Z fell out of use, though, it was removed from the alphabet, leaving ABCDEF. Over time, C attained the K sound in addition to G. To prevent confusion over which sound was intended, a slightly modified version of the letter was created, and added to the part of the alphabet once taken by Z - ABCDEFG.

Back to Greek. Rather than tell you everything about it, I'll tell you the parts that intrigue me the most.

1. Greek has a definite article, i.e., a word for "the". Latin does not have any article, definite or otherwise.

2. Greek has a dual number in addition to the singular and plural. That is, there is a word for I, we-two, and we. Sadly, this is little used in the period that I am studying.

3. Greek loves compound words, whereas compounding words is almost entirely alien to Latin. Philosophos means "wisefriend" (philos - friend, sophos - wise), demokratos means "peoplepower" (demos - people, kratos - power), "theophilos" is "Godfriend" (theos - God, philos - friend), "hippopotamos" is "riverhorse" (hippos - horse, potamos - river).

4. The language has the peculiar quirk of treating several objects as singular when it comes to verbs. E.g., "πίπτουσιν", "they fall", is a plural verb. However, to say that neuter objects like apples are falling, you would use the singular "μῆλα πίπτει". Literally, this isn't "apples fall" but "apples falls".

More comments when and if I feel like it.

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Fri Jun 10, 2011 9:32 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Edit - *dactylic* hexameter, not iambic.

An example of Latin poetry, demonstrating the flexibility of word order, elision, and my memorization of the first seven lines of the Aeneid.

Publius Vergilius Maro wrote:
arma virumque cano, troiae qui primus ab oris
italiam, fato profugus, laviniaque venit
litora multum ille et terris, iactatus et alto
vi superum, saevae memorem, Iunonis ob iram;
multa quoque et bello passus, dum conderet urbem
inferretque deos latio, genus unde latinum
albanique patres, atque altae moenia romae


In writing, I only capitalize proper names of living things and occasionally the beginnings of sentences. This is my personal preference, but there are no rules in Latin capitalization.

Translating word-for-word, just to show the word order (but not really saying anything for the meaning), you get this:

Arms and-a-man I sing, of-Troy who first from the-coasts
to-Italy, by-fate a-fugitive, and-to-the-lavinian came
to-the-shores much that-man and by-the-lands, tossed and by-the-depth
by-the-power of-the-gods-above of-cruel remembered of-Juno on-account-of wrath;
many-things too and in-war endured, until was-founding the-city
and-was-bringing-in the-gods to-Latium, the-race whence Latin
and-the-Albanian fathers and-also of-high the-walls of-Rome

See why I am putting of poetry?

Anyway, here's a good (but not direct) translation of those lines:

A. S. Kline wrote:
I sing of arms and the man, he who, exiled by fate,
first came from the coast of Troy to Italy, and to
Lavinian shores – hurled about endlessly by land and sea,
by the will of the gods, by cruel Juno’s remorseless anger,
long suffering also in war, until he founded a city
and brought his gods to Latium: from that the Latin people
came, the lords of Alba Longa, the walls of noble Rome.


Elision is "the omission of a letter or syllable between two words" (that's in quotes because I ripped the definition from Wiktionary). This happens very frequently in Latin - when a word ends in a vowel or M, and the next word starts with a vowel or H, the last syllable of the first word is elided. For example, multum ille et is pronounced mult'ill'et. The reason why final M and initial H are elided is because they are both very weak in Latin - final M simply means that the vowel before it is nasalized (think of a Frenchman laughing - "ho ho ho!"), and H is just... H.

Commas were not written in the original, but pauses are implied by metrical constructions called caesurae. I would have to tell you all about how dactylic hexameter works in Latin (it isn't stress-based like English!) to explain how we tell where the caesurae are... meanwhile, you would fall asleep and wish I would shut up.

I will finish this post by posting a good recording of the first bit of the Aeneid.

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Sat Jun 11, 2011 7:25 pm
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Ne sus Minervam doceat - Let not the swine teach Minerva. I read this some time ago, and it was brought to my mind when listening to a coworker smart-mouth his dad, the boss.

Minerva is, of course, the Roman goddess of wisdom, among other things.

I am getting sick of pizza. Hattrick, I won't hound you about your promise for a while. I think I'll eat some paper in the meantime.

Lonlonjp, on YouTube, is a very good video game music guitarist. He covers Chrono Trigger and Zelda, among other things. Give him a listen.

I haven't studied anything in a few weeks, my Greek is getting rustier by the day. My Latin, on the other hand, is set well enough so as to not degenerate so quickly. All the same, I really need to tackle my book.

I have a kitten now. She eats feet for breakfast.

I am about to fill out my FAFSA for the spring semester. I shall take this moment to observe that I still don't understand why names of seasons aren't capitalized.

I am going to look for data recovery services in my area for my laptop. I always have the option to restore it to factory condition, which would result in no major loss, but there are things such as tax information, a transcription I was in the middle of*, and certain things pertaining to this forum that I would hate to lose.

*If your teacher told you that clauses may never end in prepositions, then he or she was an utter idiot who blindly followed a myth. Sentences have been ending in prepositions for as long as the English language has existed. Chaucer, Shakespeare, and the highly educated blokes ("blokes" because they were British) who composed the KJV of the Christian Bible all ended sentences and clauses with prepositions.

Hmmm.... that is all that I have to say. Oh, wait, a few more notes and I will be done:

Hahae - Haha
Hem - Hm
Atat! or Attat! - Uh-oh!
St! - Sh!

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Fri Jun 17, 2011 1:01 am
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Post Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Quod licet Iovi non licet bovi

"What is permissible to Jove* is not permissible to cattle."

*Jupiter

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Fri Jun 17, 2011 10:30 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
A few Latin phrases that we often see:

Et al. — short for some form of "et alii", "and the others". Often seen when referring to authors of a book, i.e., "Lewis, Short et al."

Et cetera — "and the rest". Come on, didn't you ever watch "The King and I"?

Per se — "Through/in itself". A lot of people, thinking it is English, spell it "per say". This misconception is probaby reinforced by the fact that it usually refers to the technical meaning of a word, and "say" just happens to relate to speaking.

Also, wise man say: "Man who stand on toilet is high on pot!"

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Tue Jun 21, 2011 12:05 am
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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
SirVenom wrote:
Also, wise man say: "Man who stand on toilet is high on pot!"

You don't have to tell me twice. -_-"

A wise man once told me, "bitches be crazy."

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Post Re: Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine

What do you think of this?

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Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:44 pm
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Post Meum journal of rerum that have nihil to do with latine
Zombie paper is good stuff. Tents with faces should burn. The video creators should proofread their work :p

Here is a realistic representation of the life of a Jew (I assume, I haven't watched the movie) under Roman rule:


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Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:37 pm
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